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Thread: oil analysis

  1. #1
    Junior Member madman's Avatar
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    Default oil analysis

    Does CubCrafters have a recommended source for oil analysis? I've changed my oil twice, and sent samples to the firm that has been doing my 310 for years, and the results I've received indicate they think I have a new twin.
    Jim McCabe
    Carbon Cub SS #153

  2. #2
    Senior Member randylervold's Avatar
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    Default Re: oil analysis

    Aviation Consumer does comparison tests on oil analysis labs about every five years and Blackstone consistenly comes out on top. For my money they are the pick. Latest comparison attached, and here's their web site... http://www.blackstone-labs.com/
    Attached Files Attached Files
    Randy Lervold

  3. #3
    Senior Member RanRan's Avatar
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    Default Re: oil analysis

    Quote Originally Posted by randylervold View Post
    Aviation Consumer does comparison tests on oil analysis labs about every five years and Blackstone consistenly comes out on top. For my money they are the pick. Latest comparison attached, and here's their web site... http://www.blackstone-labs.com/
    Come on guys. I read the report and this just seems over-the-top anal to me. Sheesh. Maybe on some high-performance aircraft that sinks like a friggin' stone in a power out...but these are Cubs for pete's-sake!

    Fly along, watch for idiots, listen to XM radio and thoroughly enjoy. If it gets suddenly very quiet, land on someone's lawn or field and lap-up your 10 minutes of fame.

    Honestly, it's crap like this that keeps the average joe from taking to the skies and general aircraft from selling more airplanes. i.e. 99.9% of the market. 'There's no such thing as Safe flying' Let's reinforce that thought here. Lovely.

    So you get a lab report that's 'inconclusive' by any definition. Then what? Fly scared? Screw that. Take your 200k and buy a sailboat - you know, low and slow.
    Last edited by RanRan; 04-09-2011 at 08:35 PM.

  4. #4
    Senior Member randylervold's Avatar
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    Default Re: oil analysis

    RanRan, with all due respect I'm afraid I can't agree with your take on oil analysis, though that's the beauty of owning your own aircraft, we each get to operate our aircraft any way we like. I submit there are two compelling reasons for oil analysis...

    #1 Protection of investment - Oil analysis will usually point to a problem developing inside your engine that you wouldn't know about otherwise. Such problems can often be caught early preventing further problems and reducing the cost to remedy. Also, this will let an owner have a better chance of reaching TBO and getting a better return on their investment. It can also point out bad operating habits and give you a chance to change them. Frankly, an oil analysis history is a positive feature when you go to sell your aircraft as well and may well make the difference between a buyer selecting your plane over another.

    #2 Safety - If a catastrophic engine failure occurs at an inoportune time you are putting yourself, your passenger, and citizens on the ground at risk. If my engine is making metal and is about to fail I want to know about it in advance if possible, seems a bit irresponsible to me not to.

    Though I've never found a problem with oil analysis in my own aircraft I have several close friends who have that I have personally witnessed. They avoided disaster and more expensive repairs in each case.

    Just curious, haven't you ever wanted to know what's going on inside your own engine that is keeping you and your loved ones aloft over those nasty inhospitable mountains? Don't you want to maximize the significant investment you've made in your aircraft? Have you ever personally had an in-flight engine failure and tasted the stark freaking terror that can result?

    FWIW,
    Randy Lervold

  5. #5
    Senior Member RanRan's Avatar
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    Default Re: oil analysis

    I just don't think the 'analysis' is worth much. It measures a point in time. There's always going to be traces of iron, chrome, aluminum, water and what have you in any oil. Bottom-line: the data is almost worthless from oil change to oil change - too many variables.

    A pilot's analysis is much more reliable - is the engine running smoothly? what do the plugs or oil filter look like? Simple, straightforward stuff.

    So the engine is running fine and you get a worrisome 'analysis' back - now what? Do you then tear the engine apart? Or fly worried? Sell it?

    I know your concern for safety, but you are also the marketing guy there - implying that I'm irresponsible for not getting some superfluous (truly, meaningless) test done on a perfectly running engine is a bit much. I imagine I'll find some company in that category.
    Last edited by RanRan; 04-10-2011 at 02:18 PM.

  6. #6
    Senior Member randylervold's Avatar
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    Default Re: oil analysis

    RanRan, no implication intended at all. You're right about each analysis being a moment in time, but the real benefit comes in a continual regimen where you can watch trends relative to how you've operated the aircraft.
    Randy Lervold

  7. #7
    Senior Member RanRan's Avatar
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    Default Re: oil analysis

    Quote Originally Posted by randylervold View Post
    RanRan, no implication intended at all. You're right about each analysis being a moment in time, but the real benefit comes in a continual regimen where you can watch trends relative to how you've operated the aircraft.
    Randy, I know you know how hard it is to get good, reliable data. Bad data would lull one into thinking that all is well, when it isn't or vice versa. One test, one lab, once every fifty hours is not reliable data. It's VooDoo. The 'trends' produced are just as shady.

    This testing is over such miniscule amounts of stuff that interpretive errors will abound. And always, always after the fact. I'd much rather rely on my senses and instruments (which is ongoing - not momentary). I'd much rather DEPEND on a simple compression check (which I would do at oil change) to tell me that my chromium levels are probably out of whack. Know what I mean?

    Why make an expensive hobby more so? And then lay on the guilt when someone draws the line? That's not fair. It's about good practice, constant maintenance and a passion for doing things well - none of which add a dime. Money cannot buy confidence and peace of mind that is brother to it - try as it may.

    I will, however, draw another line if I must seek your permission to buy a CC airplane - seeing that I am, obviously, a reckless and opinionated person.

    Oh, and you could send me a cap...just for the heck of it. ;-)

    Your devil's advocate,
    Ran
    Last edited by RanRan; 04-10-2011 at 06:09 PM.

  8. #8
    Senior Member RanRan's Avatar
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    Default Re: oil analysis

    An update. I spoke with Randy this morning and he is sending me a cap. Hah! ...and I can buy as many CubCrafters airplanes as I like. ;-)

    We're much closer to being in agreement than this thread would indicate. We had a great conversation. CC is the best for a lot of reasons...Randy is one of them.

    Now for the 'He'll say anything for a cap.' crowd. Hey, it's just a cap!

  9. #9
    Senior Member RanRan's Avatar
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    Default Re: oil analysis

    Hey, Randy, is there a simply software solution that allows voting on certain questions? That would be most interesting.

  10. #10
    Administrator Pete D's Avatar
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    Default Re: oil analysis

    If you post a new topic under "additional options" below where you write your post you have the option of creating a poll with up to 10 options.....

    Pete D

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