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Thread: FLAPS 2 Notches VS. 3

  1. #31
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    Default Re: FLAPS 2 Notches VS. 3

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Harper View Post
    Once again, the CCSS weighs in...remember that in comparison to an EX or FX, I generally operate very light. On takeoffs, I use the back country aviation method. I count and move with the count: Full throttle, Elevator full forward, one-one thousand, (as soon as the throttle is forward, I move my hand to the flap handle and push the lock button), Two-onethousand, full flaps, neutral elevator and generally am in the air. The count is to remind me if the airplane is on schedule (engine running right and such). If the tail isn't up by one one thousand, something is wrong...back on the throttle and abort. Left the carb heat on for a recent takeoff...tail wasn't up...aborted. Fixed it and started over.

    The flaps are never locked, per se...I just milk them off as it feels right. Sounds dramatic, but is good practice for when you need it...very entertaining for the folks at the airport, and I generally fly from the infield, so it does cut down on bouncing around on rough ground.

    On a light SS, the one-two count works fine. If I was flying heavier, or in a, say, Maul, it might be a two count before lifting the tail and then another two before flaps.

    Final point...I've got the 3x3 landing gear and I'm pretty sure it is nigh on to impossible to put the prop on the ground.

    Jim
    Great info Jim. Thanks for sharing!

  2. #32
    Senior Member Springloaded's Avatar
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    Default Re: FLAPS 2 Notches VS. 3

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Harper View Post

    Final point...I've got the 3x3 landing gear and I'm pretty sure it is nigh on to impossible to put the prop on the ground.

    Jim
    Hmmm🤔
    I know of 2 and I watched one hit the ground w/3x3.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Chuck Kinberger
    Florida Cubcrafter Sales
    Jupiter Fl.
    SWT Aviation
    Chuck@swtaviation.com
    You can sit at home & hear the News or get out there & be the News

  3. #33
    Senior Member TroyBranch's Avatar
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    Default FLAPS 2 Notches VS. 3

    I should have been more explicit, I pull to three notches when I rotate. Usually start with one notch on take off. It definitely gets me off the shortest.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  4. #34
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    Default Re: FLAPS 2 Notches VS. 3

    Hey Chuck? Those nose to the ground excursions occurred on takeoffs? Or, more likely on landing? Certainly with a vigorous series of bounces, it is sadly too easy to run the prop into the ground...heck, it is done with some regularity on Cirri, even. On the other hand, if any of the three occurred on takeoff, let me know and I'll re-evaluate my thesis...

    Re-reading my takeoff routine, I worked too hard to get the count in...in actuality, after full throttle I sort of pulse the elevator to full down until the tail is up...less than a second and it occurs during my one-onethousand count...and then neutralize the elevator. I've included a video of a takeoff in New Mexico which shows the routine. Note the count is a little longer...we're at over 7000 feet.

    [URL]https://youtu.be/GcwjDeMNoIw[URL]

    Jim
    Last edited by Jim Harper; 04-03-2017 at 06:02 AM.

  5. #35
    Senior Member Springloaded's Avatar
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    Default Re: FLAPS 2 Notches VS. 3

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Harper View Post
    Hey Chuck? Those nose to the ground excursions occurred on takeoffs? Or, more likely on landing? Certainly with a vigorous series of bounces, it is sadly too easy to run the prop into the ground...heck, it is done with some regularity on Cirri, even. On the other hand, if any of the three occurred on takeoff, let me know and I'll re-evaluate my thesis...

    Re-reading my takeoff routine, I worked too hard to get the count in...in actuality, after full throttle I sort of pulse the elevator to full down until the tail is up...less than a second and it occurs during my one-onethousand count...and then neutralize the elevator. I've included a video of a takeoff in New Mexico which shows the routine. Note the count is a little longer...we're at over 7000 feet.

    Jim https://youtu.be/GcwjDeMNoIw
    Hey Jim
    1 was for takeoff didn't make it. 1 was landing and there was no bounce. Your technique is fine just didn't want anybody to get the impression they can't hit the prop because they had 3x3. I know of another one that did it on run up. All pilot error for sure.
    Chuck
    Chuck Kinberger
    Florida Cubcrafter Sales
    Jupiter Fl.
    SWT Aviation
    Chuck@swtaviation.com
    You can sit at home & hear the News or get out there & be the News

  6. #36
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    Default Re: FLAPS 2 Notches VS. 3

    Quote Originally Posted by Springloaded View Post
    Hey Jim
    1 was for takeoff didn't make it. 1 was landing and there was no bounce. Your technique is fine just didn't want anybody to get the impression they can't hit the prop because they had 3x3. I know of another one that did it on run up. All pilot error for sure.
    Chuck
    Fair enough, Chuck. I'm sure that it can be done. But, damn, you'd have to almost try. Especially on run up. Full throttle, full brakes, and full down elevator, I suppose. As one gets to know one's airplane stuff like that seems impossible...but you're right. It can be done.

    Jim

  7. #37
    Senior Member Dan L's Avatar
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    Default Re: FLAPS 2 Notches VS. 3

    Quote Originally Posted by Dan L View Post
    That's an interesting comment on using 3-notches for take-off. I'll have to try that again. I don't have the new flap design though. What is maximum angle of deflection with 3-notches? I think it is 50 on the original EX.

    When I flew the FX demo with the new flaps I couldn't tell a performance difference between the new and old styles. The big difference was the lack of pitch change with the new flaps.

    I'll give the 3-notches a try for take-off the next time I fly the EX.

    Attachment 6239

    The FX and my EX on the day I flew them both.
    I was able to get out this afternoon and do some takeoff tests with 2 and 3 notches with my EX. For me, 2 notches gave me the shortest takeoffs. And 2 is better than 1 also.

    And 3 on landing always the shortest.

    FWIW.
    Flying Carbon Cub EX #11

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