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Thread: Titan engine problem

  1. #1
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    Default Titan engine problem

    When I started on my annual inspection this week, I found a weak cylinder. 30 hours ago #4 measured 70/80 but this week was more like 30/80. The other 3 were good and unchanged over 30 hours. I ran the plane on the ground again and remeasured. No miraculous recovery. I then flew above my field for 45 minutes, and that didn't help either.
    The rush of air escaping the cylinder appears loudest from the carb. The engine has 450 hours.
    On a lark, I called Continental to pick someone's brain as to why a cylinder would wilt so suddenly and be leaking from an intake, in my opinion unusual. They put me through to Bobby Looper who worked on the development of the Titan. To say the least, he was helpful and informed. Immediately, he said, "pull all four valve covers and measure the push rod clearances".
    When I did that the three good cylinders are all within spec. (0.028/0.080). #4 is very tight on both intake and exhaust, maybe 0.012. Also, it takes quite a force on the push rod to get 0.012 compared to the others.
    Bobby told me there had been issues over time with the valve seats moving and reducing push rod clearance.
    Later this week I plan to examine #4 with a boroscope and then pull it.
    I will post when I know more. Jake #175
    Last edited by 1473C; 06-20-2016 at 05:25 AM.

  2. #2
    Senior Member Clay Hammond's Avatar
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    Default Re: Titan engine problem

    Great info Jake. Glad Titan was forthright and helpful!
    _______________________
    Clay Hammond

  3. #3
    Senior Member c130jake's Avatar
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    Default Re: Titan engine problem

    I did my initial start on my EX today and #4 is bad too. New engine. Little egt rise. Checked plugs, ignition, removed primer. I will talk to Mitch tomorrow for more trouble shooting. I wonder if mine is doing the same thing. I know nearly nothing about engines.

    Jake Hayes

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    Jake
    Finished CCEX N96FV!

  4. #4
    Senior Member Cubrath's Avatar
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    Default Re: Titan engine problem

    Jake,

    Don't rely just on EGT. Probes could be loose or bad. Could be a loose ignition wire. What did it do? Mine was rough for the first 30 seconds then smoothed out. I'm sure Mitch will walk you through it.

  5. #5
    Senior Member c130jake's Avatar
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    Default Re: Titan engine problem

    Ran rough, #4 was cold to the touch while the other three were hot. Plugs were wet, swapped plugs with #2, no change. Checked for spark, rechecked electronic ignition. Ran the same on left, right, and both.

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    Jake
    Finished CCEX N96FV!

  6. #6
    Senior Member Cubrath's Avatar
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    Default Re: Titan engine problem

    I'm no engine expert either but it sounds like an ignition problem to me if the plug is wet. Did you try running on the left ignition box then the right? I would also check all your connections in the electronic ignition. My bet would be the #4 ignition coil in the front of the engine. Swap it and see if the problem follows.
    Last edited by Cubrath; 06-22-2016 at 09:01 AM.

  7. #7
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    Default Re: Titan engine problem

    image.jpg. This is what my #4 cylinder looks like internally. To my eye, hot gases have been exiting the intake valve. The inside of the intake tube is black carbon. I have decided to let the Kamloops crew take a first look at the seat. Looks like if anybody has reduced push rod clearance, they should take action. Jake

  8. #8
    Member DRL's Avatar
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    Default Re: Titan engine problem

    Quote Originally Posted by c130jake View Post
    Ran rough, #4 was cold to the touch while the other three were hot. Plugs were wet, swapped plugs with #2, no change. Checked for spark, rechecked electronic ignition. Ran the same on left, right, and both.

    Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk
    It would be worth looking at the flag connectors on the coils. It is difficult to get good connections with these type connectors and it is possible to have more than one bad crimp. An intermittent connection may not show up until after start. It took us a few attempts to get these right.

    A bad coil or an ignition box would affect more than one cylinder.

  9. #9
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    Default Re: Titan engine problem

    I feel strongly that I should make the following recommendation:
    You folks have not seen the piston, piston rod or valve area in the attached photo of the last post.
    That whole area had been extremely hot. The hot side of the piston was discolored, the intake valve area was white, the hot end of the piston rod showed what looked like solder, the seat is voided. I only got the piston rod out after hours of repeated taps left and right. The end of the connecting rod has been warm, but the bearing is smooth to the touch.
    Remember no intake valve cooling was occurring in this cylinder.
    I had only flown this plane 30 hours since the last annual. Many of you fly several hundred hours a year.
    If I had flown N829CC 170 more hours I have no doubt that A major failure was waiting.
    I am not a newbie. My love of flight began in 1970. I have enjoyed thousands of flight hours. One reason I write this is that over the years I have dealt with two complete engine failures. Lady Luck smiled both times and said, " Jake, welcome to earth."
    The simple thing to do is as follows:
    1. First consult any one you trust and ask for advice.
    2. Unless they object, pull all four valve covers and check push rod clearance.
    3. If you have clearance less than 0.028, ask the person you trust for advice.
    We are talking at most two hours of work here. Good luck. jakemorrel@yahoo.com

  10. #10
    Senior Member Cubrath's Avatar
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    Default Re: Titan engine problem

    Jake,

    Did you have a CHT/EGT monitor on that cylinder? Did you see any other signs other than low compressions at annual?

    I guess the system worked, you found the problem before it found you!!

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